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 Broadband-Hamnet™ Forum :: How we used HSMM-MESH™
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 Subject :Airborne Nodes - Your thoughts?.. 2013-12-27- 03:29:36 
N9CNM
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Joined: 2013-12-25- 17:20:21
Posts: 12
Location: Rio Rancho, NM

My initial interest with HSMM radio is to provide a datalink from an aircraft to the ground, or to take a node (or nodes) up in an airplane to provide wide area broadband access in an emergency. I wonder if I could get any ideas from others about whether is is feasible and what any issues might be. What about using 5 GHz and ODFM where we don't have a power limitation? In a Civil Air Patrol (or other emergency service) type of mission it could be highly useful to be able to downlink images and video in real time - what kind of range might we sensibly be able to get?

Your thoughts?

John, N9CNM
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 Subject :Airborne Nodes - Your thoughts?.. 2013-12-29- 03:08:18 
wx5u
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Joined: 2013-01-02- 00:30:45
Posts: 188
Location: Austin, TX

Airplane use is going to be somewhat less useful than you might think.  

Unless your ground stations are using beam antennas and tracking the plane, the node in the plane will pick up every civilian wifi or other 2.4 GHz station in the coverage area, and it won't be able to pick the correct ground station out of the noise.   Even if the ground station hears the aerial station, you won't be able to communicate if the aerial station can't hear you. 

You'll get some benefit, especially if you're in an area without a lot of wifi and other 2.4 GHz users

These days, even in the country, there are a lot of people with wireless routers, bluetooth, cordless phones, etc. 

Long distance 802.11g usually means beam antennas on both ends.

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I'm not part of the development team, so take what I say with a grain of salt. I'm also easily confused.

Check out the free Wireless Networking Book
 Subject :Re:Airborne Nodes - Your thoughts?.. 2013-12-29- 12:34:49 
KC9OIS
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Joined: 2013-06-25- 22:32:51
Posts: 8
Location: Green Bay, Wisconsin
 
We are looking at ballons. I ran across this video on wifi via tethered balloon. Used for "wardriving" in this application (circa 2008). They use a 6 foot tethered balloon filled with helium at 150 feet, carrying at 3.5lb payload. The basic payload consisted of a WRT54G router, a CCD camera with pan & tilt control, an omni-directional, a directional antenna and a fiber optic transceiver and a couple of 9v batteries all packaged in a small Igloo Mini-Mate cooler. The concept could be easily adapted for HSMM for use during special events or possibly emergencies. Could provide excellent covering of 5 - 10 miles or more in urban areas Here's the link to the video http://youtu.be/oRgITWJrBY8 and a link to the presentation https://www.defcon.org/images/defcon-16/dc16-presentations/defcon-16-hill.pdf
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Dennis, KC9OIS
 Subject :Re:Airborne Nodes - Your thoughts?.. 2014-10-12- 18:40:46 
K7BCV
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Joined: 2014-10-10- 14:09:45
Posts: 2
Location: 
interesting idea. My guess is that the FAA and the FCC might be bigger problems than the physics involved. One word of advice --- do NOT attach the mesh node and other equipment to the aircraft in any way that might be construed as permanent. Doing so would require a Supplementary Type Certificate for the aircraft.
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 Subject :Re:Airborne Nodes - Your thoughts?.. 2014-10-13- 02:55:12 
N9CNM
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Joined: 2013-12-25- 17:20:21
Posts: 12
Location: Rio Rancho, NM
...unless it is an experimental, which mine would be.
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 Subject :Re:Airborne Nodes - Your thoughts?.. 2014-10-13- 06:50:45 
AE6XE
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Joined: 2013-11-05- 00:09:51
Posts: 116
Location: 
From a cost perspective, an airplane may not be practical, but yet a fun experiment. I'd give it a try once or twice. Local 100LL is over $7/gal here. A 3 hour flight to support an incident @ ~8GPH in a c172 is ~$170 not to mention maintenance costs. Just need to figure out how to mount something like a 2-channel 19dB flatpanel-sector antenna pointing straight down. Clamp on a strut with the hurricane certified antenna? I have a node at 2600' with the homes below ~800' in the area with a range out 20+ miles. Somewhat comparable to flying over an incident. Being straight overhead in a holding pattern would probably be better as most home users point their antennas straight up and donut propagate outward.
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 Subject :Re:Airborne Nodes - Your thoughts?.. 2014-10-13- 07:18:48 
K7BCV
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Joined: 2014-10-10- 14:09:45
Posts: 2
Location: 

An experimental aircraft would be fun, but this might be better done by a drone. Have you thought about that approach?
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 Subject :Re:Re:Airborne Nodes - Your thoughts?.. 2014-10-13- 14:05:14 
kc2mut
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Joined: 2014-10-12- 17:48:52
Posts: 3
Location: New York



Max flight time for a battery powered multirotor drone would be 25min and fixed wing about 45min. With a gas powered fixed wing you can get 24 hours.

The commercial versions have the ability to carry +2 pound payload and autonomous fligh but have a price tag of $50,000! A tethered RC blimp or balloon is ideal. Also no issues with FAA.

I once mounted a wifi hotspot to a multirotor but wasn't satisfied with the results.

I am also looking in to using a Mesh Node mounted to a tethered balloon.



[K7BCV 2014-10-13- 07:18:48]:

An experimental aircraft would be fun, but this might be better done by a drone. Have you thought about that approach?
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Last Edited On: 2014-10-13- 16:07:41 By kc2mut for the Reason
 Subject :Re:Airborne Nodes - Your thoughts?.. 2014-10-19- 12:45:59 
kc2mut
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Joined: 2014-10-12- 17:48:52
Posts: 3
Location: New York
look in to tethered RC blimp or balloon https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4EvvY5LQ4g
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 Subject :Re:Airborne Nodes - Your thoughts?.. 2014-10-19- 12:46:02 
kc2mut
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Joined: 2014-10-12- 17:48:52
Posts: 3
Location: New York
look in to tethered RC blimp or balloon https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4EvvY5LQ4g
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